Bye Bye

wobo · Posted: Fri May 18, 2007 10:23 am Post subject: Bye Bye

Times they are a-changing. Yesterday, after working for Mandriva right from the start (Version 5.3) and being a contractor for Mandriva since early 2001 my contract has been terminated by Mandriva to the end of this month.

Because of this long relation to Mandrakesoft/Mandriva (I guess it's one of the longest in this crowd) I take the liberty to add a few words to this info:

I understand the pressure a new investor is putting on the management, and so I understand the move to "fire" some long standing fine contractors like Per Oyvind Karlsen, Oden Erikson, me, and more that I don't know about. This is not an unusual act in our times. The consequences are a totally different issue, though, especially on the German side. And that does not only mean the community, but also the business part, because due to the absence of local Mandriva partner I have been to unofficial German contact for all kinds of interested clients, partners, etc.

I mean, who will do the German translations of the official pages in the Mandriva website, the press releases, newsflashes, Community Newsletter? THere was nmobody in sight who would take over at the end of this month. Maybe there will be a committed volunteer coming up soon, I hope so on behalf of the German suers and customers.

My community commitment? Well, I am a community person and will stay one, that come with the genes. Smile

But for Mandriva? You may understand that there are some doubts about that on my side. Maybe Mandriva expects that I will continue to do (cost free) the things I did while being paid - just out of habit or good community commitment. I don't think so, although David Barth had the nerve to suggest this in his mail! I did much more for the German community than I was paid for - I even spent some of that money on travelling and participating at events on behalf of the community and (unofficially of the company). So nobody can really say that I am only working as long as the cash is coming in.

I don't know what will become of MandrivaUser.de, the Mandriva community platform I founded back in 2003, being now the official subsitute of the German Club forum - there are a lot of people upset and talking about changing the distribution, some wrote mails to David and 2-3 of the leading contributors are thinking about leaving (even the chief editor of our community magazine MagDriva). You may also imagine the impact on the newly formed translation team for the Mandriva wiki. One member of that team has stopped working in the middle of a text. Another contributor who did a large part of the German localisation for Mandriva Linux is thinking about terminating his long standing contribution. Well, this is not my concern or even in my hands.

So, in spite of the economical rule that less cost means more income, this may cost Mandriva more than my small monthly paycheck was worth.

Whatever: I had a wonderful time, seeing the company grow up from a 2-room backyard office near the Père LaChaîse in Paris to a worldwide major player, seeing first the forum, then the club come to life. I lived through the unpleasant times of Mandriva's financial problems. I met a lot of interesting and fine people, including this platform here, especially the club primates who do an extremely good job. I hate to leave all this but I will have to find new priorities, bound by a (hopefully soon to come) new job. And of course I will dedicate my spare time to the new area - if there is a need for my skills and commitment.

Thx for keeping company

wobo
PS: Adam/RJ, could anyone pls remove the "Mandriva" tag from my name at the end of this month, thank you.
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Germ · Posted: Fri May 18, 2007 10:46 am Post subject:

I am really sorry to hear that and extremely disappointed with Mandriva. A very stupid move on their part...
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Goran_Jartin · Posted: Fri May 18, 2007 10:47 am Post subject:

This was very bad news, indeed Sad

It may mean that one of the most reliable voices at the Mandrivaclub forums will be silenced.

I've read hundreds of postings by wobo, that have helped me enormously, and for which I am very thankful.

This also makes me quite a bit worried about the future of Mandriva. Is this what they mean with the talk about a new, community supported distro??

rjf1 · Posted: Fri May 18, 2007 2:19 pm Post subject:

I'm really sorry to see this. I have learned a lot from reading your posts, and have always felt that you added an extra dimension to the forums.

Nothing makes me madder than to see these bean counters cut their own throats by reciting the [erroneous] mantra that 'cost down' means higher profits. They all seem to get brainwashed with that old shibboleth at MBA school. 'Profits up' should be the mantra -- and it doesn't always follow that cost down leads to that -- there is the other adage: 'you have to spend money to make money' that sits on the other side of the balance -- but they don't seem to teach that at MBA kindergarten anymore.

I have worked at companies where the management lost thousands of dollars worth of sales because they wouldn't spend an extra hundred dollars to promote a product properly. To this day those morons think they 'saved' a hundred dollars -- it never dawns on them that they actually lost thousands.

Anyway, sorry for the rant -- it's just that I'm really disappointed that we are losing you. I know you will do well in the next endeavor that comes your way. It's Mandriva's loss, really -- too bad it has to be ours, as well.

RJ

wheatie · Posted: Fri May 18, 2007 2:31 pm Post subject:

I'm sorry to see you go. Your work and contributiions to Mandriva will be missed by the community. Good luck in the future and hopefully we'll still see you around from time to time.
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manuel L · Posted: Fri May 18, 2007 4:09 pm Post subject:

awilliamson · Posted: Fri May 18, 2007 7:45 pm Post subject:

I personally and everyone I've talked to is really sorry to see Wobo (and the other contractors who have gone) leave, and it really is a purely economical decision. I wish it could have happened some other way. Sad

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obiwan · Posted: Sat May 19, 2007 4:31 am Post subject:

It's sad to see you go. Hope you stick around on the forum a bit.

d.

wobo · Posted: Sat May 19, 2007 9:32 am Post subject:

Although I am a bit embarrassed by all the flattering (smiling inside), it was not my intention to come fishing for compliments - my intention was rather to explain why it was a mistake to kick me out.

You "have to invest money to generate revenue" and "cost reduction is the way to earn money" - both phrases are correct, but only so far as they are used in the right way. Every move you make in business has consequences. So before doing something you should contemplate what consequences this move will cause. Then think about what you win and what you lose. Then go for it or let it be. IMHO David has forgotten one of these points.

Or I'm totally wrong and Mandriva isn't interested in the area I spent most of my activities. If so, then he was right to kick me out - an asset in the wrong place is no asset at all.

wobo
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obiwan · Posted: Sat May 19, 2007 2:15 pm Post subject:

But what does it help to explain to the people here that letting you go was a mistake? I think we can only offer compassion and regret. I think the message that it is a mistake should be delivered directly to the management.

Of course, they will not listen/understand. I haven't liked Mandriva's management for over 4 years. I'm convinced they are the core of many problems with the distro. I feel they are not in touch with the users (at least, the *ordinary* users, maybe they do interesting deals with companies/governments, but I don't know about that).

But, they are the people in charge and there is nothing much we can do (well, not completely. if 10000 people cancel their subscription because of this, I they may rethink their decission.

d.

wobo · Posted: Sat May 19, 2007 6:32 pm Post subject:

Visionary · Posted: Sat May 19, 2007 7:51 pm Post subject:

Some of us here are a bit ignorant of what you have done, myself included.

I have always know that you have played a vital role as your contributions to this forum have always been informative and of the highest quality.

So please can you give a rough idea of what you have done, as this would reveal to all of us what we're going to loose?

Visionary

Germ · Posted: Sat May 19, 2007 8:30 pm Post subject:

I'm not sure if it will help but I'm one of those who sent emails to David Barth.
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wobo · Posted: Sun May 20, 2007 5:03 am Post subject:

manuel L · Posted: Sun May 20, 2007 1:14 pm Post subject:

wobo · Posted: Sun May 20, 2007 8:21 pm Post subject:

teknokraft · Posted: Mon May 21, 2007 12:47 am Post subject: This ticks me off.

I'm sorry wobo, but I've been waiting to respond here, to try to think of an objective way of looking at it.

I'm sorry, I haven't been able to find one.

They want to cut costs? Jebus. Let's start by getting rid of the people who don't know what they're doing, and keep moving on with the ones who do.

Maybe, just maybe, Mandriva would be able to put up a decent site that stays updated for once.

Maybe, just maybe, Mandriva would be able to maintain its own (well, not really "their own", I'm talking about the sources like for urpmi and such) servers a lot better (among other things).

Just ticks me off.

Please do, stay around. The little people are going to need you here. And, we happen to like you, too.

Forget the big guys. When I see stuff like this happening, it's enough to make me want to cancel membership.

Edit to add: As far as I'm concerned, whoever fired you can go @!$% themselves.

wobo · Posted: Mon May 21, 2007 7:31 am Post subject:

What is happening? After Warly in March now the next of the dinosaurs wrote in the cooker ml that "after 8 years at Mandriva, it is time for me to leave the boat".

At the end of this month Lenny Cartier will leave Mandriva and "leave behind thousands of free and commercial packages that will require maintenance".

wobo
PS: will this become the thread of the farewell sayers?
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Germ · Posted: Mon May 21, 2007 11:05 am Post subject:

wow...it's not looking good.
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proyvind · Posted: Mon May 21, 2007 12:31 pm Post subject:

At least I'll stay around for a while on the community side Smile

Mandriva != Mandriva Linux

MartinSGill · Posted: Mon May 21, 2007 1:13 pm Post subject:

I'm really sorry to see you go. Far too often to count when I searched the forum for an answer to an issue it would be your posts that provided the answer.

I suspect one of the reasons it's only contractors going is because it's much easier to "fire" contractors than employees. Employees tend to have a lot more rights.

I have to admit that this latest exodus from Mandriva has me very concerned.

I don't want to be pessimistic about this, but Mandriva are making it hard. Since there aren't any real club benefits left and I only renewed my membership recently in the hope that things would improve, I'd like to point out that sacking important contributors is not really would I would consider improvement.

The great 2007.1 release has been marred, eclipsed almost, by the growing sense of disenfranchisement I'm feeling with Mandriva's corporate management.

I wish you all the best wobo, wherever you end up. You'll be sorely missed.
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Germ · Posted: Mon May 21, 2007 2:33 pm Post subject:

wobo · Posted: Mon May 21, 2007 5:19 pm Post subject:

I will concentrate my presence on the German community, I won't leave that.

BTW: If any of you is near Berlin, Germany, next week, be sure to come by our MandrivaUser.de booth at the Linuxtag exhibition, May 30 thru June 2.

wobo
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ShiyuTang · Posted: Tue May 22, 2007 1:37 am Post subject:

I have already made my decision to support Ubuntu instead of Mandriva. Mandriva has too many problems and I cannot see anything the company made to improve its products. http://www.shiyutang.com/en/2007/05/bye-bye-mandriva.html

I don't know if there is anyone who will take charge of Chinese translation and community support. It seems that there are still two Chinese supporters to do the work. So I can leave without any worriment.

proyvind · Posted: Tue May 22, 2007 3:48 am Post subject:

hmm, sad to hear..

I would like to point out that Mandriva the company != Mandriva Linux, so sad to see people leaving it due to controversy from the company..

I know at least that wobo and probably joeghi which got laid off will still be involved in the community, and probably some of the others being laid off too. There is also ongoing work on improving the community around Mandriva Linux which I hope to happen soon, which will give most people new faith, I'm at least very excited about these things. Smile

For Mandriva the company, I think Mandriva yet again failed at communicating and explain their actions and the news probably slipped out through the wrong channels a bit too soon for it to explain, so I think at least people should be aware of this. These layoffs were requested by the new investors to reduce costs before investing, so Mandriva didn't have that much choice. Still, I don't think their handling of the layoffs nor decissions about whom was the best..

For me now, I've just accepted another position in the company, so I know that I'll be staying around as well as I don't think these recent changes will have too much impact on my work. (I sure hope that especially the decission about laying off wobo will be reevaluated though..)